No, I've been listening. It's just that nobody has been making any actual points besides 'stfu'. So thank you for bringing the discussion back to technicals.
Your point re: Intel peripherals is true today, but wasn't really true ten years ago. It's also a bit hard to talk about the Linux kernel today, as there is obviously a lot of money and other support such that every little piece is fully tended to by someone.
So my real question is why do the old drivers have to leave the tree or at least become perma deprecated? Is there that many breaking interface changes for which drivers cannot be mostly mechanically updated? I know this is a problem that the kernel devs managed just fine over the years (sure there's been individual broken drivers accompanying major changes, but there's a big difference between saying 'the latest kernel breaks your network card' and indefinitely unsupporting your entire computer.
Maybe I'm just looking at the wrong level of CM publishes (just the releases) and hence I'm out of touch on the actual status of "unsupported" workings on various devices.
And sheesh, the alleged entitlement is the same as with any open source project - I put my faith in the project and would like to continue doing so. I'm not asking for them to conjure up someone to magically do extra work to support my device, I'm asking why they don't change their process such that this extra work is unnecessary in the first place.
> Intel peripherals is true today, but wasn't really true ten years ago.
Absolutely. Linux was a nightmare to get properly working then. Trust me, I remember. You essentially bought hardware that you knew was going to work. You couldn't buy anything just off-the-shelf and expect it work.
Same problem with mobile.
> So my real question is why do the old drivers have to leave the tree or at least become perma deprecated?
Because Google keeps messing with the kernel? Which is fine, they have to move the platform forward.
> Is there that many breaking interface changes for which drivers cannot be mostly mechanically updated?
Most drivers are closed source. You only have binaries. This is truly unfortunate. So if the manufacturer of the component doesn't release the source (almost never happens) or a new device goes on the market with the same component and updated Android (almost never happens), you're stuck in a very unfortunate place.
Even the slightest change will break everything.
> I know this is a problem that the kernel devs managed just fine over the years
No, they didn't manage shit. They hacked. Hacking takes effort and time. Nobody wants to spend time on old hardware.
> I'm not asking for them to conjure up someone to magically do extra work to support my device ..
You are asking that because ...
> I'm asking why they don't change their process such that this extra work is unnecessary in the first place.
Every version of Android generally uses a newer kernel release, but many Android drivers are binary-only and thus cannot be updated to work with newer kernels. To get ICS working on the G2, for example, hackers had to create a frankenkernel that could load old 2.6.x drivers but had the 3.x features that ICS needs. This is a lot of work and it has to be done for every SoC. Also, I get the impression that the custom ROM community is not well-organized.
Finally an actual simple explanation about where the source of the problem actually stems from! A similar thing happened to my ATI X1400 with newer X.Orgs (So when that motherboard died, I upgraded to Intel graphics).
Reading the oldnewthing MS money story the other day, I couldn't help but feeling that something was lost with the emphasis on source compatibility and programming to the abstraction. Clearly there's countless of benefits of doing such, but I'm starting to feel as if making ABIs more prominent wouldn't be the worst thing either.
Your point re: Intel peripherals is true today, but wasn't really true ten years ago. It's also a bit hard to talk about the Linux kernel today, as there is obviously a lot of money and other support such that every little piece is fully tended to by someone.
So my real question is why do the old drivers have to leave the tree or at least become perma deprecated? Is there that many breaking interface changes for which drivers cannot be mostly mechanically updated? I know this is a problem that the kernel devs managed just fine over the years (sure there's been individual broken drivers accompanying major changes, but there's a big difference between saying 'the latest kernel breaks your network card' and indefinitely unsupporting your entire computer.
Maybe I'm just looking at the wrong level of CM publishes (just the releases) and hence I'm out of touch on the actual status of "unsupported" workings on various devices.
And sheesh, the alleged entitlement is the same as with any open source project - I put my faith in the project and would like to continue doing so. I'm not asking for them to conjure up someone to magically do extra work to support my device, I'm asking why they don't change their process such that this extra work is unnecessary in the first place.